Funding for “To the Contrary,” provided by: This week, on “To the Contrary,” people want it to be the happiest time.

But depending on what's going on in their life, the reality doesn't always mirror the expectations.

We all need to give ourselves permission to have a little bit of grace towards ourselves, to realize things aren't going to be perfect, that we don't have to do that one extra thing, that we can say no to the work party that we don't want to go to.

Hello, I'm Bonnie Erbé.

Welcome to “To the Contrary,” a discussion of news and social trends from diverse perspectives.

The holidays are coming up or are upon us.

This is a time many associate with family, togetherness and joy.

But there is a dark side.

Holiday stress.

A recent survey found that many more people feel stress increasing rather than decreasing during the “happiest season of all.” Loneliness, financial burdens, fatigue, family tension, and seasonal affective disorder are some of the factors involved, and holiday stress can vary greatly between men and women, each facing unique challenges during the festive season.

With us today to discuss this topic are Dr. Vaile Wright, senior director of the Office of Healthcare Innovation at the American Psychological Association, and Cynthia James, a life coach and author with a background in psychology and consciousness.

Welcome to you both.

Nice to be with you, Bonnie.

Thank you.

Let's start with you, Dr. Wright.

They do call it the happiest time of year.

Is that how most Americans experience it?

I think most Americans do experience it as joyous and happy.

But that also comes along with stress.

They're not mutually exclusive because it's a really busy time.

And it might be that you're traveling.

You are buying gifts, you're attending parties or hosting things you might not normally do, and all your other responsibilities are still going on.

So I think a lot of that causes people to just feel more stressed than usual.

And, Cynthia, your thoughts about that same question.

You know, I think it depends on your life situation.

I think people want it to be the happiest time.

But depending on what's going on in their life, you know, they have a lot of expectations.

And so the reality doesn't always mirror the expectations.

You know, sometimes there's financial strain, like how do I do all of this to support people, the family dynamics that go on.

Sometimes people are just overcommitted.

They don't know how to take care of themselves.

And there's cultural pressure.

So I think it just depends on where you are.

And do you know how to take care of yourself in a time?

It could be a time of grief and loss as well.

Also, we're going to get into in a minute, gender differences in dealing with holiday stress or feeling holiday stress.

What about, people of color versus white people?

You know, where I grew up, for people of color, it's a time of celebration, its a time of food.

You know, food is always the big deal.

But it also can be a time of stress if you are, if you're not financially secure.

When I grew up, we were on welfare, so it was like, can we get 1 or 2 presents underneath?

And I think it's just where people are living.

But for people of color, it's definitely a time, can we celebrate?

Can we get together?

Can we, can we party?

Can we honor each other?

And can we share food?

And then to both of you, each of you just jump in whenever.

What about how men and women experience this stress differently?

Well, we know from studies that women experience greater levels of stress relative to men in general, right?

It both all during the year, as well as during the holidays.

And that's probably in large part because women are the ones most often responsible with the cooking and the cleaning, the gift buying.

The holiday planning.

But men are not immune to the stress either.

I think that men are aware of the financial pressures, as Cynthia was mentioning, for a lot of families, of how you come up with extra income, particularly during the holidays.

I also think men want their families to be happy during this time of year.

And that they can feel their wives or their partners stress and don't necessarily know what to do about it.

So I think both groups do experience stress during this time of year.

It just looks a little different.

I think for women there is a caregiving, aspect to our nature.

And so we want people to feel good.

We want the food to be right.

We want the presence to be right.

We want, we want people to come and experience joy.

And we take on that responsibility a lot within ourselves.

And the men want the same thing.

But because of the way we've been in culturated as women, you know, they will help with the planning, the project kind of thing.

But the women are the one who take on, I'm going to make sure this is the best Christmas you've ever had.

And I think, you know, you mentioned it.

About the finances.

You're going to a grocery store today, and it's sticker shock all over the place.

How is that the fact that we inflation is cooling down, but we've just been through a longer period of it.

How is that affecting everybody's holiday stress?

Huge.

I think it's like, how do you stretch your money as far as you can to create comfort and care and nurturing when the financial state is clear at this moment and things are more expensive.

So can you do that by inviting other people to bring things?

Can you do that by not taking all of the stress on yourself?

And I think that there is a lot of pressure around commercialization and buying things.

I mean, all the ads you see are really about purchasing gifts and products and things for your life.

They're less about what are the memories you want to build, what are the traditions you want to honor, you know, where are your values in this place?

And I think that that is one of the ways we can buffer some of the stress, particularly around the financial burdens.

And, you know, you mentioned the the advertising and such and the companies pushing products, especially, you know, somewhat Thanksgiving, but especially Christmas, you know, and the ads for Christmas start before Christmas, before Thanksgiving is even over.

So the advertisers are really pushing this.

How, do people take that as stressful, if particularly if they don't have the money to buy a lot of Christmas presents?

Well, I think it gives this false impression that everybody can buy all these things, right?

That a car for Christmas is a normal gift.

And so I think that does, you know, again, sort of give a false lens to what most people's reality are, and we are prone to compare ourselves to others.

And when we feel like we're not performing or doing something as well as everybody else has a tendency to make us feel more stress, not as great about ourselves.

Yeah.

And a lot of those advertisement enticements are pointed at children.

So the children start asking you to do stuff.

Oh, I want this and I want that.

And they come with their list, you know, whether you can fulfill those lists or not.

And so then I think it becomes the parent's responsibility to be able to have conversations about the reality of what they can and cannot do, and that not everybody can do what those ads are saying.

And coping mechanisms.

What do you, what do you recommend to parents?

To cousins, to grandparents?

What have you, to keep the children's expectations in check?

Can you prepare them and say, look, this is you know, you're you'll always have a roof over your head and you'll always have food to eat.

But we are having a bit of a rough time financially right now, so please, keep it to one present or let me work with you to choose a present that we can afford.

How about that or other?

What are their coping strategies do you have?

I think that's a really, you know, assertive and, you know, gentle way of asking for what you need.

I mean, so I certainly encourage people to do that.

You also have to remember that you can communicate perfectly.

You can tell people exactly what you want and what you don't want and why, and have a good rationale.

And they still might do whatever it is that they want to do.

So you always kind of have to have this backup plan in your mind too.

Of like, okay, I've made my ask, but if they're not going to honor it, then how do I address that?

Do I dole out presents throughout the year instead of giving them all at once or some other type of moderation technique that you can do to again try to honor your values and what you asked for.

You know, I think gifts are lovely, but I think love is more important.

And so if you can communicate to your family the deep desire to be loving and caring and nurturing, you know, and the reality of what is happening, you know, and in families, you can ask people to share the loads in terms of food.

They can bring different kinds of food or if, you know, aunts and uncles want to bring presents, you can share that.

But I think the important thing is to remind our children that we're, that this time is to celebrate together, to practice gratitude and to bring more love.

And what do you, what tips do you have for singles who are living alone?

May be living in a new city for work or education.

Don't know anybody there.

And don't get invited to Thanksgiving.

What coping strategies for them, please?

Well, I can speak from experience.

It wasn't that I was in a town where I didn't know people, but I and this was before social media.

I put out a call to friends and said, anybody who's alone at the holiday, lets gather at my house and let's do a potluck.

And it became a tradition.

And so I think, you know, if you're new, if you're in a new job or something, you know, if you've connected to people, you can open that conversation, that dialog.

Are there any other people who might be alone during this time?

Yeah, I think social connection right now is critical to addressing our stress and, you know, I think what we learned from the pandemic is it doesn't always have to be our closest relationships that bring us joy.

So if you are finding yourself single or in a new city or you just aren't able to connect in person with individuals, take yourself out to dinner, take yourself to the coffee shop.

Just be around other people so that you can feel that energy so you can have that connection.

I think even those small pieces can be helpful.

And who knows who you might strike up a conversation with.

That's very interesting that you both mentioned this because my husband and I for many, many years went to a couple's house, a friend of his and his wife, probably for 20 years for Thanksgiving and then the husband passed a few years ago, and the wife decided that she did not want to do that.

Her kids were in California, in Colorado.

She lives here in the D.C. area, and she didn't want to do Thanksgiving anymore.

So we were kind of left with, oh, boy what do we do now?

And we don't have any relatives who live nearby.

So we called a lot of friends and said, are you spoken for for Thanksgiving?

If not, would you like to come here, blah blah blah blah.

And we're now in about our fifth year of doing that, and it has worked out really well.

Tell me now, starting with you, Dr. Wright about seasonal affective disorder.

I know all about it very well.

Unfortunately, because I experience it and, so please tell the audience what it is and what you should do about it and how it impacts holiday stress.

Sure.

So seasonal affective disorder is just a subset of depression and impacts about 5% of the population, typically women more than men.

The symptoms look very similar to depression.

So sadness, loss of interest and activities.

But what makes it different is its rapid onset during a particular part of the year.

And it's sort of remission that spontaneously happens when that season of the year ends.

Typically.

So that's often winter and it's believed it's because of the decrease in daylight hours.

So daylight or sunlight really has a huge impact on our brains by increasing our serotonin, which is our happy chemicals.

And it does all sorts of things like, increase our vitamin D and other, you know, parts of our body that, that support our health and well-being.

So it's really critical that people get outside.

If you can take walks outside, leave your sunglasses at home because you want that sunlight to filter in through your eyes when the sun is at its best, usually in the morning, can you take a cup of coffee over to the window and sit and be there?

Because it can have an impact on our stress.

As you can imagine it, it lowers our interest in doing things.

It reduces our energy levels.

And when you're in such a busy time of the year, you might need to compensate for some of that by asking for some help.

There's something called a bio bright light.

It's a pair of full spectrum bulbs, or a set of six of them.

Three and three into each eye that you wear a visor.

And, if I sit under that light for 20 minutes on a particularly dark day, it will.

It doesn't cure it, but it will really help a lot to, you know, to overcome the feelings of despondency and and loneliness, etc.

Cynthia James, your thoughts.

When there's reduced daylight and colder weather, it can actually intensify fatigue, sadness, irritability that you've already been experiences.

And then you got the pressure of holiday obligations and expectations and social gatherings, and it can feel overwhelming.

And then that exemplifies what you're already going through as a result of the season change.

And I like what you said about the light therapy.

Light therapy is great.

Getting out into the light.

I also think doing regular exercise and seeking support, with help, you know, for your moods, and to help you open your mind to the fact that you're not alone, you don't have to be isolated and you don't have to pull back in order to try to function.

Very interesting.

Now, what about we talked a little bit about this already, but talk about societal expectations.

A lot of this is communicated through media.

Everybody's happy, everybody's smiling, everybody's agreeing with each other.

And yet, first of all, politically, we're a very divided country.

And there was just an election that we were, most of the time on the show, we talk politics.

And one of our political panelists was saying that she has Thanksgiving with a very large family, and most of the family supported one of the candidates, but a small segment of the family supported the other.

And that created problems around the Thanksgiving table and at Christmas time.

Cynthia James, your thoughts on that first, please?

Well, I want to, I want to give an example because it's very true what you're saying, but I have a client who's of Asian descent and is going through something similar.

And when I asked him how he was coping, he said he had to put the judgments that he was carrying aside, and he had to put his attention on the love of that family.

And what he could bring in those moments, and to just agree with everyone that we're not going to bring up politics.

We're not going to do that right now, and we're definitely not going to bring up religion either.

We're just going to how can we be together and celebrate?

Because his parents are getting older and so they don't know how many more years they have to be together.

Yeah.

I think you're hearing a lot of messages in the media right now about how we can't come together, how you should just, you know, not be with your family if they are on the other side of the political divide this year.

And I'm not here to tell people what to do.

But I will say that, that is not a solution to the divisiveness that we're experiencing in this country, that we really do need to find ways and there are ways for families to come together even when they disagree.

It's not always easy, and you're always not going to be effective.

But there are ways to do it.

And I think it's what Cynthia said.

It's a bit about putting judgment aside.

It's about setting some boundaries around what you can, what people are going to be talking about at the dinner table and if they, you know, break the rule, maybe send them to the kids table instead.

It's the punishment.

So I think that there are times and places to have these conversations.

They're important conversations to have.

It doesn't have to happen at the holidays.

And what about well are those the did I leave out any societal expectations that you want to talk about?

Either of you?

There is this sense, I think, particularly for women, of being perfect, that everything has to be perfect.

And unfortunately that's just not a realistic expectation.

So you are setting yourself up to fail if that's the approach you're trying to take.

And I think instead, you know, we all need to give ourselves permission to have a little bit of grace towards ourselves to realize things aren't going to be perfect, that we don't have to do that one extra thing, that we can say no to the work party that we don't want to go to.

I think we just need to kind of cut ourselves some slack.

Very good idea.

And your thoughts, Cynthia, there's this weirdness that happens around holidays where people start putting on masks and the mask is, oh, everything's okay, and I'm so fine.

And, you know, and we're afraid to be vulnerable.

We're afraid to share what's really happening because we don't want to be a downer in the space.

But I think vulnerability opens the heart with people and allows them to be together in a deeper, richer way.

And what about that old song that, you know, on Thanksgiving?

And probably on Christmas, too?

The women are in the kitchen cooking the meal and, men are watching football.

Is that how younger Americans, Gen Xers, Gen wires are doing it, or is that passé?

Well, don't forget the, don't forget the devices.

There's the games and then there's the devices.

I think the kitchen is the heart.

And so people may be doing these other things, but they're floating in and out of the kitchen tasting stuff, doing stuff like that.

And the women I think are in there more.

But I come from a family where the men like to cook and so and so the game's on.

That's not going anywhere.

But they are, they're sharing.

And devices, let's talk about how that increases, you know, stress during the holiday season.

The kids are doing nothing but playing games.

They're having harder times forming friendships.

What impact do cell phones and laptops have on people's ability to connect to each other during these holidays?

We know from some data from our Stress in America surveys in the past that individuals who say they are constantly connected to the devices have higher levels of stress.

So it's clear that there's some sort of connection there.

I would argue that not all device use is the same.

So if you're using devices to video chat your grandparents, right.

And that's what kids are using it for.

That's very different than using your device to play a video game.

So I think it's a little bit about how you use them that matters, its how often you're using them.

It's why you're using them, you know?

Is that the only way you feel like you can connect?

And then how can you find other ways, maybe even healthier ways to really make these connections in real life?

How can you do both?

And we know that social media has both positive and very negative impacts.

So I always tell people, you know, our devices aren't going away, but how can you give yourself some permission to not be on them all the time?

Can you put them in the other room when you're doing an activity as a family, for example, cooking or watching a movie?

I recently just took off all my social media apps to give myself a break, and I can't tell you how much happier I am at the moment.

Will that happen forever?

I don't know, but I began to recognize just how much negativity I was being exposed to on a daily basis.

All I wanted to do was see my friends dogs, but all I was seeing was political ads.

And so again, I think it's about really setting yourself down and reflecting on are the things that I'm doing in line with my values.

And if they aren't, what kind of changes can I make that are small but maintainable to address my stress?

I think it's about boundaries that we spoke that word earlier.

It's really, you know, my granddaughters can be in the same room and be texting each other, which I think is hysterical.

I'm like, talk to the person that's across the room.

But in our family, it's like, okay, when we're going to have dinner, when we're going to do something as a family, the devices go down.

When my granddaughters used to come and spend summers with us, we would tell them at a certain time of the night the cellphones went off, you know, they weren't going to be up texting all night and whatever.

And of course, there was grumbling.

But then we got to spend more family time and snuggle and do things that kept the connection stronger.

So I think your clarity on not just what you value, but what your boundaries are so that everybody's in agreement can really help.

One thing to that I wanted to bring up is a lot of people, I'm told, feel grief during the holidays for family members who are no longer or, you know, important spouses of relatives or what have you, who are no longer there, who are no longer alive, what tips do you give, starting with your Dr. Wright, to people in this situation and how do they experience it and how should they protect themselves?

Yeah, it is definitely a tough time of year for a lot of people.

For me personally, I had two significant lost of loved ones during this month of December.

And so, you know, during the month of December.

So I think it's a little bit about just recognizing that these dates this time of year can be a real trigger, not judging yourself for feeling sad, recognizing that there is no right way to grieve, and that you just sort of have to give yourself space and time.

Doing things I think that helps honor their memory, whether that's tradition or ritual you engage in at this time of year, I think can be really helpful for some people.

You know, invoking their spirit and their memory, I think is a lovely way of honoring them in their lives and their continued impact on you.

But it is a little bit about, again, sort of just giving yourself a little grace.

And, you know, recognizing that it won't feel like this forever, but that even if they've been gone for a long time, that it is very common to have those feelings of grief come up around these times of the year.

I totally agree with Vaile.

It's like no matter how long people have been gone, their memories come in and the feelings.

Grieving isn't just a linear process.

So I think you have to allow yourself the feelings.

You have to acknowledge those feelings and know that it's a part of life in itself and honoring their memory.

You know, you can create a tradition where you light a candle or you share a story or you do something that creates the memory and the joy that person brought.

You can seek support.

But I think the most important thing is to focus on the present.

How do you engage in activities that bring you comfort and joy right now and allow the memories to be a blessing for you as opposed to just spiraling down?

All right.

Thank you so much to both of you for this absolutely enlightening session.

We really appreciate all your suggestions and all your, you know, expertise in this area.

I hope a lot of people will be helped by this program.

That's it for this edition of “To the Contrary.” Keep the conversation going on our social media platforms Instagram, Facebook, Twitter, formerly Twitter now X and TikTok.

Reach out to us at @tothecontrary and visit our website, the address on the screen and whether you agree or think to the contrary, see you next time.

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