>>> PROTEST AND RESISTANCE CAN TAKE MANY FORMS, INCLUDING BY CANCELLING YOUR MONTHLY SUBSCRIPTIONS.

THAT'S THE THINKING BEHIND A NEW CAMPAIGN BY AUTHOR SCOTT GALLOWAY, CALLING ON AMERICANS TO STAND UP TO PRESIDENT TRUMP'S IMMIGRATION POLICIES BY UNSUBSCRIBING FOR COMPANIES THAT SUPPORT HIS IMMIGRATION.

>> SCOTT, WELCOME BACK.

RECENTLY YOU LAUNCHED A CAMPAIGN TO RESIST AND UNSUBSCRIBE.

IN YOUR CALL TO ACTION YOU WRITE, FIRST WE MUST RECOGNIZE THAT THE PRESIDENT IS UNFAZED BY CITIZEN OUTRAGE, COURTS OR MEDIA.

HE RESPONDS TO ONE THING, THE MARKET.

THE MOST POTENT WEAPON IS A TARGETED, MONTH LONG STRIKE, COORDINATED CAMPAIGN THAT AFFECTS TECH COMPANIES ENABLING I.C.E.

TO EXERT MAXIMUM DAMAGE.

PEOPLE LISTENING TO THIS WILL SAY HAVEN'T THE PROTESTERS HAD AN EFFECT?

WHAT DOES THIS DO?

>> THAT'S THE OPERATIVE TERM, IN ADDITION.

PROTESTS ARE INSPIRING, FEELS GOOD TO DO SOMETHING WITH OTHER PEOPLE.

LABOR STRIKES ARE POWERFUL, GETTING PEOPLE REGISTERED TO VOTE, MEDIA COVERAGE LIKE YOU'RE DOING IS IMPORTANT.

BUT IF YOU LOOK SPECIFICALLY WHERE THE PRESIDENT HAS WALKED BACK PLANS TO ANNEX GREENLAND OR TARIFFS CRISPLY IT'S WHEN EITHER THE BOND MARKET OR THE STOCK MARKET FALLS.

WHAT I LIKE TO THINK WE'RE ZEROED IN ON, THE SOFT TISSUE OF THE MARKET IS TEN COMPANIES RESPONSIBLE FOR 40% OF THE S&P.

THEY'RE NOT ONLY ENABLING THIS PRESIDENT OR SOMETIMES PROVIDING INFRASTRUCTURE FOR I.C.E., THEY'RE ESPECIALLY SUSCEPTIBLE.

IF YOU WERE TO SEND A MESSAGE BY NOT SHOPPING FOR GROCERIES FROM KROGER, FIVE FAMILIES FOR A YEAR FOR THE SAME IMPACT AS CANCELLING ONE CHATGPT SUBSCRIPTION.

I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT A WAY TO IMPACT AND SEND A MESSAGE TO THESE CORPORATE LEADERS WHO THE PRESIDENT LISTENS TO AND THE PRESIDENT WITH MINIMAL DISRUPTION TO CONSUMERS' LIVES.

FREE GIFT WITH PURCHASE IS YOU GO ON, YOU WILL FIND OUT YOU HAVE FOUR AT&T ACCOUNTS, ONE FOR A BLACKBERRY YOU HAVEN'T USED IN YEARS.

YOU WILL FIND TWO APPLE TV PLUS ACCOUNTS AND OTHER THINGS YOU HAVEN'T CANCELED.

HIGH IMPACT WAY TO SEND A MESSAGE AND MIGHT SAVE MONEY ON THE WAY.

>> YOU TARGET TWO, GROUND ZERO AND BLAST ZONE.

YOU SAY THOSE BUSINESSES DON'T REPRESENT THE TOTALITY OF COMPLICIT BUT THE JUGULAR OF AMERICAN IMPERIALISM.

>> WHAT I CALLED GROUND ZERO IS BIG TECH COMPANIES THAT TRADE FOR BILLIONS OF DOLLARS OF MARKET VALUATION, WHO HE AROUND THE TABLE AND IS OBSESSED WITH.

MIGHT BE LINED UP FOR GOVERNMENT BACKED DEBT FINANCING OF DATA CENTERS OR CHIP FACILITIES.

BIG TECH PLATFORMS -- APPLE, ALPHABET, AMAZON, META.

THEN THE BLAST ZONE IS COMPANIES THAT HAVE MUCH LOWER MARKET CAPS BUT ARE DIRECTLY ENABLING I.C.E.

AT&T, HILTON -- THERE'S A VARIETY OF COMPANIES SPECIFICALLY AND DIRECTLY AIDING I.C.E.

'S EFFORTS.

BUT I WANT TO BE CLEAR, I'M NOT -- AS A GUY WITH ECONOMIC SECURITY, I DON'T FEEL IT'S MY RIGHT TO BE ARBITER TO SAY WHO SUBSCRIBES TO WHAT, I'M JUST TRYING TO MAKE IT EASY.

YOU MIGHT JUST PAUSE AND RESUBSCRIBE IN MARCH OR DECIDE YOU DON'T NEED THIS STUFF AND WANT TO CONTINUE SENDING A MESSAGE.

I WANT TO SEND A SIGNAL TO CONSUMERS OF A WEAPON HIDING IN PLAIN SIGHT.

IF THEY WANT TO FEEL THEY'RE DOING SOMETHING, THAT WEAPON IS THE MOST RADICAL ACT IN A CAPITALISM SOCIETY -- NONPARTICIPATION.

ALL OF US COULD PROBABLY AFFORD TO SPEND A LITTLE BIT LESS.

SIMILAR TO DRY JANUARY WHERE PEOPLE RECALIBRATE ALCOHOL INTAKE AFTER A MONTH.

THIS IS A CHANCE TO RECALIBRATE THE AUTOMATIC RENEWAL SUBSCRIPTIONS.

>> WHAT CHANGED?

>> WHEN I SAW SECRETARY NOEM DESCRIBE ALEX PRETTI, AN ICU NURSE SERVING VETERANS, A DOMESTIC TERRORIST, CLAIMING HE WAS BRANDISHING A WEAPON TO KILL FEDERAL AGENTS, I WAS SO RATTLED, THIS ATTACK ON THE DEAD AND ORWELLIAN CALL TO IGNORE OUR EYES AND EARS, I DECIDED TO DO MORE THAN HECTOR FROM THE CHEAP SEATS.

ONE OF THE REASONS I'VE BEEN ABLE TO DO THIS, WHEN I WAS YOUNGER, I STARTED A LOT OF BUSINESSES, APPLIED FOR JOBS I WASN'T QUALIFIED FOR.

AS I'M GETTING OLDER, I'M WORRIED I'M GETTING COMFORTABLE WITH HECTORING AND COMPLAINING, NOT ACTING.

I WANTED TO DO SOMETHING.

LIKE DAN HARRIS SAYS, ACTION ABSORBS ANXIETY, IT FEELS REALLY GOOD TO ACTUALLY BE TRYING TO DO SOMETHING.

>> I WONDER IF THIS KIND OF PROTEST WORKS, IF IT'S LONG ENOUGH.

AS YOU DESCRIBED, ENORMOUS COMPANIES.

CAN'T THEY RIDE IT OUT, WILL THEY NOTICE IF SAY TENS OF THOUSANDS UNSUBSCRIBE?

THEY HAVE MILLIONS OF CUSTOMERS.

>> 100%.

DEATH BY 1,000 CUTS, IF THERE'S ENOUGH, YOU HAVE AN IMPACT.

I'M ANALYTICAL, WE'RE GETTING 1,600,000 VISITORS TO THE SITE, RESISTANDUNSUB.COM.

I'VE GOT SCREEN ANALYTICS AND SCREENSHOTS TO FREE CHATGPT AND ASKED IT TO ESTIMATE UNSUBS.

IT'S SAYING 100,000 TO 200,000 UNSUBS.

I THINK THAT'S 150 TO 200 MILLION IN MARKET CAP.

MY GOAL IS A BILLION.

THAT IS NOT ENOUGH.

WHAT I'M FINDING, I'VE HEARD FROM 20% OF THE CEOs, AND THE WAY IT'S DESCRIBED TO ME, THE PROJECT MANAGEMENT TEAMS AND MIDDLE MANAGEMENT IS TALKING ABOUT IT, BUT IT'S NOT AT THE BOARD LEVEL YET.

I FEEL THIS IS JUST ANOTHER ACTION IN ADDITION TO PROTESTS, TO GETTING PEOPLE TO REGISTER TO VOTE, TO MEDIA COVERAGE, AND WHAT THE GREAT PEOPLE OF MINNEAPOLIS ARE DOING.

I WANT TO BE A SMALL HAIR IN THE HORSE'S TAIL THAT PEOPLE NOTICE.

BUT YOU'RE RIGHT, I'M NOT, SO FAR TO BE HONEST, THE ADMINISTRATION HASN'T BACKED DOWN AND THE COMPANIES, I'M NOT SURE HAVE NOTICED.

BUT I DON'T THINK THAT'S A REASON TO STOP.

EVERY EFFORT COUNTS FOR SOMETHING.

>> WHEN YOU HEAR FROM CEOs AND COMPANIES, A LOT OF THEM WILL TELL YOU LOOK, NOTHING WE'RE DOING IS ILLEGAL AND SOME MIGHT USE THE RATIONALE MY RESPONSIBILITY IS TO THE SHAREHOLDERS OF THE COMPANY AND THE PENSION FUNDS AND EVERYBODY ELSE.

AND IT'S A SLIPPERY SLOPE TO BACK AWAY FROM THIS ADMINISTRATION OR THE NEXT.

HOW TO KEEP TRACK.

WHAT IS YOUR RESPONSE?

>> I TRY TO TELL THEM HISTORY IS BLUNT AND CLEAR AROUND THIS.

I'M REMISS TO COMPARE THIS ADMINISTRATION TO THE THIRD REICH, I THINK THAT'S UNFAIR.

BUT I THINK WE CAN DRAW ANALOGIES FROM LATE STAGE WEIMAR REPUBLIC.

THERE WAS A LOSS, ECONOMIC LOSS TO MIDDLE AGED MEN, AND CAPTAINS OF INDUSTRY MADE A DEAL WITH FASCISTS, INCLUDING HITLER, IF YOU CRUSH THE UNIONS WE'LL IGNORE THE SLOW BURN TOWARDS FASCISM BECAUSE YOU'RE GOING TO MAKE US RICHER.

WHAT I HEAR FROM CEOs PRIVATELY, THEY'RE VERY UPSET ABOUT WHAT IS GOING ON BUT AFRAID TO GO FIRST TO BE SMACKED DOWN.

A GOOD AUTOCRAT PUNISHES WHOEVER GOES FIRST.

I'M TRYING TO ENCOURAGE THEM TO TAKE COLLECTIVE ACTION.

I SAY TO THEM, WHAT IS THE POINT OF HAVING ALL THIS MONEY AND BUILD THIS AMAZING COMPANY IF YOU DON'T HAVE FIDELITY TO INTEGRITY, BASIC RIGHTS.

LOT OF THEM ARE IMMIGRANTS THEMSELVES.

WHAT DO YOU WANT TO BE REMEMBERED FOR?

STOP USING THE TERM STAKEHOLDERS, USE SHAREHOLDERS.

FEELS LIKE YOU'RE IGNORING STAKEHOLDERS LIKE THE U.S., IMMIGRANTS, THE CONSTITUTION.

BUT I HAVE EMPATHY FOR THE FACT UNLESS IT'S COLLECTIVE ACTION, IT'S VERY DIFFICULT FOR ANY ONE FIRM TO GO FIRST.

BUT I'M SHOCKED AND DISAPPOINTED MORE INDIVIDUALS HAVE NOT SPOKEN OUT.

THEY'RE SPEAKING OUT PRIVATELY TO EACH OTHER BUT DON'T WANT TO SPEAK OUT PUBLICLY.

AGAIN, I GO BACK TO THE NOTION, HOW DO YOU WANT TO BE REMEMBERED?

WHAT IS THE POINT OF HAVING ALL THIS MONEY IF YOU CAN'T AT LEAST NOD TO SOME OF THE PRINCIPLES THAT HAVE GIVEN YOU SO MUCH WEALTH AND HELPED YOU BUILD SUCH AN AMAZING COMPANY?

>> I WONDER IF WE'VE SEEN EXAMPLES OF PROTESTS THAT WORK AND PROTESTS THAT WORK.

THERE WERE CALLS FOR PEOPLE TO BOYCOTT TESLA WHILE ELON MUSK WAS TAKING A CHAINSAW THROUGH DIFFERENT GOVERNMENT AGENCIES.

A SIGNIFICANT RESPONSE TO DISNEY WHEN JIMMY KIMMEL WAS CANCELED FOR A FEW DAYS.

IS IT THE ACTUAL PROTEST, OR THE VISIBILITY, YOU AND I TALKING ABOUT IT THAT MAKES THE DIFFERENCE?

>> GREAT QUESTION.

I'VE DONE A DEEP DIVE.

FIRST OFF, MAJORITY OF ECONOMIC PROTESTS DON'T WORK, THEY COME AND GO, NO IMPACT, LIKE A TREE FALLING IN THE FOREST.

RECENTLY, DISNEY AND JIMMY KIMMEL.

WHEN DISNEY DECIDED TO PUT HIM BACK ON THE AIR, UNSUBSCRIPTIONS WAS DECLINING, IT WAS MEDIA COVERAGE AND IMPACT TO THE BRAND.

THE STRIKE POINTED TO AS SUCCESSFUL STRIKE, MOST THINK OF IT WAS A BRAVE WOMAN REFUSING TO GIVE UP HER SEAT.

IT WAS ACTUALLY A 12-MONTH SUSTAINED BOYCOTT THAT DR.

KING ORGANIZED CARPOOLS AND OVER THE COURSE OF A YEAR, MUNICIPAL TRANSPORTATION AUTHORITY WAS LOSING MORE THAN A MILLION A MONTH AND THEN THEY DESEGREGATED THE BUSSES.

I'M CALLING THE STRIKE FOR MONTH OF FEBRUARY AND MAY LEAVE THE SITE UP, IF I GET MOMENTUM, MAYBE WE CONTINUE IT.

BUT THE ECONOMIC STRIKES THAT WORK ARE CUMULATIVE, BUILD OVER TIME, AND MORE ABOUT NOT ONLY MEDIA COVERAGE BUT TRADITIONAL MEDIA COVERAGE.

>> RIGHT NOW IT SEEMS IT'S REALLY HARD FOR THE AVERAGE AMERICAN FAMILY TO EXTRICATE THEMSELVES FROM THE COMPANIES.

83% OF U.S.

HOUSEHOLDS ARE SHOPPING WITH AMAZON, 40% OF ALL U.S.

E-COMMERCE IN THE COUNTRY.

WHEN YOU LOOK AT THE PLATFORM OF AMAZON, THOUSANDS OF SMALL RETAILERS WHO REALLY NEED AMAZON TO SURVIVE, THIS SEEMS SO INEXTRICABLY LINKED.

WE DON'T HAVE A FAIR MARKETPLACE TO SAY I'M NOT GOING TO USE AMAZON BUT THIS ONE THAT'S JUST AS GOOD.

>> YOU'RE EXACTLY RIGHT.

WHEN INDUSTRIES ARE ALLOWED TO CONSOLIDATE TO THE POINT IT'S OLIGOPOLIES AND NONMONOPOLIES, THEY CAN CREATE A LACK OF OPTIONS.

ONE OF MY HOMES IN AMERICA, I DON'T LIKE COAL FIRE PLANTS BUT STILL GOING TO TURN ON THE LIGHTS.

THAT'S ALL THAT IS OFFERED.

WHEN SMALL TECH FORMS CONTROL THE MEDIA, COMMERCE AND SEARCH, IT'S INCREASINGLY DIFFICULT TO UNSUBSCRIBE.

FORTUNATELY I THINK PEOPLE WILL FIND THEY HAVE DUPLICATES OF AND CAN GO FROM ONE TO -- I WAS TAKING 350 UBERS A YEAR.

BECAUSE THEY'RE CONSOLIDATED THE RIDE HAILING, THEY'VE RAISED PRICES SO MUCH I'M PAYING DOUBLE WHAT I WAS PAYING SEVEN YEARS AGO.

SO I'M GOING TO TAKE THE TUBE AND SUBWAY MORE.

BUT THE CONSOLIDATION OF INDUSTRY ACROSS PHARMA AND CHICKEN CREATES A LACK OF OPTIONS.

BIG DISCUSSION AROUND POLITICS HAS BEEN AROUND AFFORDABILITY.

THERE'S NO SILVER BULLET.

IT MEANS IN MY VIEW, FREE TRADE, THIS TARIFF NONSENSE IS NONSENSE, BUT ALSO A BREAKUP IN ANTITRUST.

WE NEED A TRUST BUSTER TO ENSURE THERE ARE CHOICES WHICH ULTIMATELY CREATE A RETRANSFER BACK OF ITAL AND POWER BACK TO SHAREHOLDERS AND CONSUMERS.

BUT IT'S SO HARD TO UNSUBSCRIBE FROM AMAZON BECAUSE THERE'S A LACK OF OPTIONS.

CONCENTRATION OF INDUSTRY, MONOPOLY POWER, IT GOES ACROSS A VARIETY OF DIMENSIONS.

>> HAS SOMETHING CHANGED IN THE DNA OF WHO WE ARE AS A COUNTRY?

FAMOUSLY FROM BOSTON TEA PARTY ON, OUR FOUNDING WAS REALLY OUT OF PROTEST.

WHILE WE DO SEE PEOPLE STANDING IN SUBZERO WEATHER IN MINNEAPOLIS, AND IN LOS ANGELES AND PORTLAND WHEN I.C.E.

COMES TO TOWN, THE REST OF THE COUNTRY SEEMS TO BE WATCHING.

>> I THINK WE DO SUFFER FROM AN IDOLATRY OF INNOVATORS AND THE DOLLAR.

OUR HEROES ARE NOW BILLIONAIRES AND CAPTAINS OF INDUSTRY, AS OPPOSED TO ELECTED OFFICIALS, ATHLETES, OR PEOPLE WHO LEAD CIVIL RIGHTS ACTIONS.

THERE IS SORT OF AN OBSESSION OR IDOLATRY OF THE DOLLAR.

BUT I'M HOPEFUL.

IT'S EASY TO BECOME BEREFT AND THINK THE NATION HAS NEVER FACED PROBLEMS LIKE THIS.

1% OF THE POPULATION WHO OWNED SLAVES CONTROLLED THE COUNTRY.

WE WERE INTERNING JAPANESE AMERICANS AND PUT THEM BEHIND BARBED WIRE.

WE'VE FACED TESTS OF OUR DEMOCRACY BEFORE AND EACH TIME IT'S COME BACK STRONGER AND HEALTHIER.

I LIKE TO THINK THIS IS ONE OF THOSE MOMENTS WHERE MAYBE WE'RE RECOGNIZING THE RULE OF LAW, COMPETITIVE MARKETS, RESPECT FOR IMMIGRANTS, THAT WE SHOULDN'T BE SENDING PEOPLE TO BLACK SITES OUTSIDE OF THEIR COUNTRY WITH NO RIGHTS, CONCENTRATION CAMPS.

WE SHOULD NOT HAVE FEDERAL OFFICIALS WHO WEAR MASKS.

I LIKE TO THINK THIS IS HELPING A LOT OF US UNDERSTAND THAT A LOT OF THE WONDERFUL THINGS ABOUT AMERICA HAVE BEEN TAKEN FOR GRANTED, AND THEY REQUIRE A CONTINUED INVESTMENT.

I SEE THIS IN THE PROTESTS, PEOPLE BEING ACTIVATED.

PEOPLE COMMITTED TO MAKING AMERICA AMERICA AGAIN.

I AM HOPEFUL THIS HAS BEEN A WAKE-UP CALL.

>> SCOTT GALLOWAY, PROFESSOR, PODCASTER, ACTIVIST, THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

>> THANK YOU HARI.

ALWAYS GOOD TO SEE YOU.