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- [Announcer] And now the Cascade PBS Ideas Festival featuring journalists and news- makers from around the country in conversation about the issues making headlines.

Thank you for joining us for "The Political Scene" from The New Yorker with Robby Hoffman, moderated by Tyler Foggatt.

Before we begin, a special thank you to our members.

We'd also like to thank our premiere event sponsors, Amazon and HX Expeditions, our founding sponsor, the Kerry & Linda Killinger Foundation, our session sponsor, Alaska Airlines, and our host venue, Fremont Studios.

(audience applauding) - Welcome to the Cascade PBS Ideas Festival and to a special live taping of "The Political Scene" podcast from The New Yorker.

I'm Tyler Foggatt, and I'm a senior editor at the New Yorker Magazine.

- Oh.

- And I'm really excited to be here today with one of my favorite comedians, Robby Hoffman.

- Oh, thank you, Tyler.

My God, you killed that.

(audience applauding) - When did you first realize that you were funny?

- No idea.

I come from a funny people and everybody was funny.

I only, when I was like put against normal people, it seemed that it was unusual, but it was not unusual growing up.

- So even when you were a child, you were just cracking people up and... - Everybody I knew was funny.

My mother was funny.

My brother Schmoly was funny.

I was funny.

We didn't even think it was funny.

Everything was funny.

- And how much has your humor evolved since you were a kid?

Like, have you kind of just kept doing the same thing or do you feel like as you progress as a comedian, you're like trying things out or doing a new kind of joke or just leaning more into being yourself?

- Yeah, I think just always being more me.

I think like as a kid, you're born and you're you, and then you go through school, you go through other things where it's like, oh, it's not really that good to be you.

I was annoying, I was loud, I didn't like authority.

And so you press back, and then I was boyish and that wasn't good.

And so I always was kind of watching myself.

You know, you start to get self-conscious maybe as a teenager and you go, "Oh, I'm sitting like this."

See, now I don't even think about it.

But I would've sat like that.

I would've changed to be more girly 'cause I didn't wanna be like... You know, I wanted a boyfriend.

I wanted what everybody wanted but I'm sitting like this.

You're not gonna get no boyfriend.

So I would sit like this.

And so then I started, when I started doing... Standup allows me to be the most me.

Like, like I'm me, like if you went into like the booth and you went, (Robby imitating whooshing sound), you know?

All the levers, you just put your hands and you went crazy.

Standup, I'm just flying.

And it's not like I'm not the most me now, but it's just, it's almost like a THC.

It's so concentrated in the standup and then it's a little more like a hybrid in life.

Yeah, I'm not such a weed person, but, you know, I think we know enough of the language here in Seattle, so... (audience laughing) I don't know if it's evolved.

Yes, it's always becoming more me, the most me.

I don't limit or anything.

And I also don't choose my thoughts, you know?

So I feel like if somebody gets mad at me, I said something or I was asked something and I thought something, I don't even know where thoughts come from.

I don't wanna think of half the things I think about.

But I have to, you know?

I have a joke about pedophilia.

I wish I didn't.

I wish I didn't know what it was.

I wish I never knew what it was, but alas, I do, unfortunately.

So, you know, I just talk about yeah, what I think about stuff, and I'm also joking a lot.

And that's how I grew up.

Even the worst things we joked... You know, everything was talked about.

And there was also a layer of humor that was kind of a way to deal with everything too.

- Have you ever been surprised by a person or group who got offended by a joke that you thought was like, pretty anodyne and then vice versa?

I'm wondering if you've ever been surprised by someone not getting offended by a joke that you thought was pretty hardcore.

- This just has come up for me.

You're catching me on the tail end of my first attempt at one of these groups coming for me.

It's amazing, of all the things I said in my special, and thank you for anyone who's watched the special by the grace of God and all of you.

- [Tyler] It's so good.

- It's gotten the recognition that it has solely by word of mouth.

But of all the things I talked about in that special, the only people to come after me was the pit bull community.

(audience laughing) Okay?

Like the dog people.

I talked about raising the age of abortion to the age of 10.

Okay?

The pro-lifers were... You know, nobody cared about that.

I've talked about so many things, but when you touch dogs, oh.

And then recently I did "Call Her Daddy" and she asked me a silly question about gluten or something, and the celiacs came after me.

(audience laughing) So of all the communities, it's like these ones.

And I think my point of my comedy is, and when these groups come after me, it's fine.

I know people are trying to... You know, we're angry and people are frustrated and they're trying to silo it and take it out and all this stuff.

But the whole point is, you know, that I think there's other things going on.

I think it's important why, you know, nobody is spared, so to speak.

I joke about everyone and everything.

It's not personal, you know, and find the celiacs are allergic to gluten and comedy apparently.

But... (audience laughing) But it's just also to point, and I go after my own communities and groups, it's just a point that there's other things going on.

You know, it's important not to always center ourselves in the victim narrative, especially when, you know, it's easy to get caught in those small traps.

And I think if we just came together more of us and stopped siloing so much, that's why the nobody is spared.

It's like, actually, okay, make fun of you like this.

You can make fun of me like this.

People call me a (beep), they call me a (beep), it's all good.

We're on the same side.

It's the people versus the power.

So it's yeah, just an idea not to take ourselves so seriously unless, you know, it's about, you know, serious really big things that we can come together and work on together.

I don't know how articulate that was, but they'll edit, (audience laughing) - I have to go back to the pit bull community coming after you just 'cause that's like maybe my worst fears.

- I know they're as scary as the dog.

I had no idea.

I had no idea 'cause they said that the dog sometimes looks like the owner.

You ever see this?

That they hear that the dog looks like the owner.

But I never knew it acted like the owner.

You know what I mean?

I didn't know the personality side of it, but it really is true.

You gotta be careful out there.

(audience laughing) - So, you know, just transitioning into talking about your television acting a little bit more, and you're in "Hacks," "Rooster," I should also say that you were in the FX series "Dying for Sex" where you played opposite Michelle Williams.

- [Robby] Thank you.

- But just going back to "Hacks," which had its series finale last week, you played an assistant in an entertainment agency who rises very quickly.

I know that the character was initially written for you, but how much did you have to do with the character's eventual narrative arc?

- Nothing.

- Nothing.

- Yeah, I mean, you know, they saw me-- - [Tyler] God, they captured me so well.

- Yeah, they liked me and, you know, they wrote Randi for me, and it's like all the roles I'm doing, you know, maybe, you know, I do a little version of myself, you know?

I'm not necessarily the Meryl Streep version of acting.

I'm more the Adam Sandler.

You know, I can push it.

You know, he's pushed in "Uncut Gems" and maybe, you know, for the tiniest taste, I had my push in a "Dying for Sex" role, which I think was surprising for people.

But then on the other roles, some of the, you know, fluffier roles, so to speak, Randi, she's eager, she's nerdy a bit.

She's fresh eyed and all that.

Maybe in real life I'm a little swaggier, a little more confident.

But it was fun to play that.

And then, you know, in "Rooster" with Steve Carell, I play like, you know, the opposite.

I'm still me, but I'm like this lazy roommate in a robe, you know, who's not eager and all this stuff.

Randi and I really did have a very similar story in that I was new to acting.

Randi's new to the business, Randi's trying to do a good job as an assistant, you know, keep her job.

And I'm trying to do a good job with the character to keep acting.

So we were both in a very similar, we're both new to the thing that we were doing in real life and on the show.

- So you've spoken about your childhood during your standup and in other interviews, but in case anyone in the audience doesn't know your backstory, I'm wondering if you could tell us a bit about your upbringing since it was pretty unique.

- Oh my God, what a disaster in my upbringing.

(audience laughing) I'm one of 10 kids.

I was raised predominantly by a single mother.

I'm seventh of 10 kids.

My parents had us all by the age... My mother was, I think, 30 by the time she had the 10 of us.

Yeah, enormous vagina.

I know, it's insane.

(audience laughing) It's insane.

No, that's where I get mine from.

I'm very blessed.

(audience laughing) I'm very blessed.

No, I'm my mom's seventh kid.

She had me at 27.

So we grew up poor and really limited in many ways.

But also, yeah, I don't know, it's very hard to explain to a family, maybe a nuclear family or somebody who grew up normally, like comparing a family of like 12 people to a family of four, you know, two parents, two kids versus my mom, my great uncle Eddie and the 10 kids, how I grew up.

But there's a lot of co-raising that goes on.

It's more of a community situation.

You know, it's like, yeah, there's the parentification that's unhealthy, but there's also a beautiful part to it.

You know, like my little brother is not just my little brother, he's also my son.

So the way that we were, it's just a totally different way of growing up.

- So as you mentioned, you grew up poor.

And I hope this doesn't sound weird, but I really appreciate the way that you talk about just sort of that experience.

- Why would that sound weird?

- Well, I mean, I don't know 'cause it's like, I don't know, I hope that it doesn't.

- You don't sound weird at all.

You sound great.

- No, I mean, I also grew up poor.

I mean, a totally different upbringing.

But like, yeah, I mean, it's just like, I just feel like it's one of those things where even once you get to a place of like relative financial stability, you just never get over it.

And I think that poverty tends to get romanticized in TV and film.

Like this idea of like the starving artist.

- No, no.

- And, you know, like the kid who makes it and that kind of thing.

And it just really means a lot to me, like personally that you like try so hard to consistently counter that narrative and just be like, yeah, actually that really sucked.

- Yeah.

Yeah.

And that's why it's like, I don't mind that when people get, you know, caught up on the pit bulls or whatever the issue is, I always bring it back to that.

I'm like, okay, you had your two seconds, back to this, back to this.

People still poor, people still poor, people still poor.

I just will never get distracted.

I'm like, and we're back.

People are still poor.

Here we are.

I can't get over it.

My chip is only getting bigger.

I'm horrified by the whole thing.

- I mean, how has the experience changed your orientation toward politics?

Like, I think you said in the past that Republicans and Democrats are the same thing and it's really just the rich versus the poor.

- I mean, that's what I think.

Yeah, I think it was, you know, nominal differences at the top.

I mean, you know, think about who was on Epstein's island.

So, you know, it's like they were hanging out, you know?

And they weren't hanging with us.

And that's how it always was.

As a kid, I've been through democratic administrations, Republican administrations.

Nothing, we never got a drip.

Nothing really, it didn't affect our lives at all.

- I mean, we live in a time where there are so many, like so-called populist politicians, both on the left and on the right who talk about their working class backgrounds and run on affordability platforms.

And sometimes it feels real and sometimes it just doesn't.

Like, one of my favorite jokes of yours, which I think you've said like on a couple podcasts, is just like, you're the only person who can actually prove that you worked at McDonald's.

- No, it's true because of the pictures, I know, I know.

And maybe she did, we don't know but anyway.

- But would you say that there are any politicians out there who are actually doing the populism thing right?

And when it comes to conversations about poverty, especially policy conversations, is there something that you feel is just consistently missing from those conversations that you wish people talked about more?

- Yeah, I mean, I think it's not that something's missing from those conversations, it's that that conversation has to be the conversation.

It's that sometimes they go, "Well, we were having the conversation now, so what's the problem?"

Well, we need to keep having it for 200 (beep) years 'cause how long have they been having the red versus blue before it became the way that we do things?

They've been talking red versus blue for 200 years.

So 200 years on poverty.

And then maybe I'll be okay, maybe I'll be okay.

But it just started happening.

And every time the conversation about income inequality or the classism of it all comes up, it is shut down.

You know, there are moments of it.

We had Occupy Wall Street, you know, Bernie before the DNC squashed his (beep) too.

So, you know, it's like there are conversations, but the idea is like, okay, we had it and we're moving on.

No, we're not moving on.

It's just like when Trump was asked about Epstein, they're like, "We're still talking about this?"

You better believe we are still talking about this.

(audience applauding) And I am still talking.

When somebody's mad about a loaf of bread or they're mad about a dog, I go, that's fine.

Back to here, right?

Because red versus blue had to be talked about for hundreds of years for it to be the status quo.

I want this to be the only conversation.

I want this to be what determines, so I'm repetitive.

Every interview I go back to this 'cause we need 200 years of this being... It's not just a conversation.

Classism is the conversation.

The haves versus the haves not is the conversation.

And how much worse does it need to get for you to realize that that's what it's all been about.

It's literally the people versus the power, the people versus money and power, period.

Until we can get a better grip on that, I can't see myself really screaming about anything else.

(audience applauding) - Are there any politicians who you think are centering the conversation that way?

- Oh my God, I do.

Yeah.

But it's hard to keep them there.

I think Mamdani is tremendous.

I thought Bernie, I still think Bernie is unbelievable.

I mean, I would take a senile Bernie over... I would even take him at 90, you know?

We accepted Biden for so long.

I'm like, I'll take an old Bernie even.

Even if he has half a thought, it's better than most of the full thoughts that some of the people we have.

You know what I mean?

So I think of course there are people... It has to be, again, the focus, it has to be the big... It shouldn't be fringe.

And I'll keep screaming about that until red versus blue moves back to people versus power.

- Do you think that people of different political persuasions genuinely find different things funny?

Or do you think that everyone secretly finds the same things funny, but it's just a matter of some people not allowing themselves to laugh?

- I think it's the latter.

I think it just because I think I'm a testament to that because I go everywhere.

I literally like know what's going on before... It's so funny.

Like, it's not even funny, it's tragic.

But, you know, living in LA, I think so many people around me were stunned when Trump won again.

And I was like, are you joking?

Like, I'm around this country.

I am boots on the ground and I've been to almost every state.

And yeah, I think it's an allowance thing.

I think that it's funny 'cause I go to some states where people go, "Oh, you're..." You know, I'm doing the South again and stuff like that.

And they go, I have some people come to the shows, they didn't even wanna like me.

You know what I mean?

They have preconceived notions what kind of person I am or whatever.

They didn't even wanna like me.

And they go, "All right, can I get a picture?"

You know?

It's just, yeah, laughing can be guttural and expansive and I've just gone person to person.

There's nobody I really won't talk to.

And I think that's a testament to how I grew up.

You know, I was born nine other siblings there, well, six other, and then three more came.

And yeah, I'm so comfortable being in a space, you know, where we don't always agree with tolerance, you know, to some extent.

Like, I also didn't have my own room or, you know, space that was my own.

So it's like, maybe if you're a rich kid and you fight with your sister over a t-shirt or something, you go to your room, she goes to her room, you know, bye (beep), bye, you know, whatever.

But, you know, if my sister and I were fighting, it's like the (beep) is in my room.

Like we gotta go to sleep somehow.

You know what I mean?

Like, we had to figure it out.

So I'm so comfortable coexisting with people.

We might see not eye, it's just not an issue.

I don't see it as a thing.

You know, my brother, for instance, is somewhat homophobic.

And by somewhat, I mean he's homophobic, so I'm not encouraging, but the way he calls me, he goes, you know, 'cause he's a security guard, and he goes, "They're doing pride at the... They're having me do pride."

And I'm like, "Well, you're not on a float.

Like, are you taking your shirt off?

Like you're working security for the event, which you do many events, you know?"

And he goes, "Yeah, I just don't like the whole gay agenda, this and that, and the gay people."

I said, "Well, I'm a gay person."

He's like, "Well, not you."

(audience laughing) Like, he doesn't even connect.

He's like, "I'm not talking about you, you're my flesh and blood.

Take a bullet."

He's talking about gay.

So I'm like, you know what?

I'm just leave it there.

You know, love is love.

But he doesn't really... I think people sometimes just say stuff because the heart isn't there.

And I think we were so comfortable growing up with different things and just tolerating, and also we could watch movies together, like beyond that, it's just we could hang and think differently and know that we were still in it together.

Like all is possible at the same time.

- Do you think that Donald Trump is funny?

- Extremely.

- Yeah.

- One of the funniest ever, unfortunately so.

I wish it wasn't so.

Again, comedy, it's like the question you asked me, is he funny?

Insanely funny?

I send my wife memes, you know, he's got the meme... Even the AI memes of him are good, you know?

Him walking over the bridge, you know?

It's just his stunt with McDonald's was unbelievably funny and petty.

You know what I mean?

But you don't want that for a president, you know what I mean?

Like, that was good on "The Apprentice."

Like that's not, you know?

But yeah, I gotta give it to him, he's funny.

I can't lie.

I wish I could.

See?

People get mad.

- I mean, on that note, like a lot of people have argued that like his humor is part of what helped him win the election.

- [Robby] I'm sure.

- And I guess if, like, we usually see being funny is a really good thing, like almost like a virtue because it has the power to uplift people.

But like, is there a world in which it can actually be more of like a enabling force essentially.

Like if you're really funny, can you get away with basically anything?

- No 'cause he's also really dumb.

(audience laughing) So this is the problem.

- Okay, yeah, explain this a little more.

- Like he's really funny, but when he's dumb, he's really dumb.

So he toggles those two and one really loses some people.

And the funny is like, all right, for this bit, you know, the straws was funny as hell.

You know, people talking about straws, he was totally right about that.

But then some of his (beep) is really dumb.

- I know, but I mean, I guess I don't mean like, are we willing to forgive him absolutely everything but just like I guess-- - I don't think people are forgiving him.

I think he's losing a lot of his own people.

I think he's been exposed and yeah, I don't know that people are forgiving him so much anymore.

People are really frustrated and as they should be.

And they might not know.

They might be scared still to speak out on him or whatever.

So maybe they jump on the pit bull thing or they jump on something that's a little more, you know, I'll go after, you know?

But I think deep down they're really frustrated.

- Yeah, no, I think that's definitely true.

And there are obviously a lot of people who were, you know, unwilling to forgive him anything and perhaps shouldn't.

- But I also don't forgive, you know, I also look at it again, not to do Trump versus, but, you know, Democrats, the system helps each other.

Democrats ushered him in to a large extent, you know?

So I think the system works to keep each other in power versus a new or something different, or a real system that works for the people.

You know, as soon as the system, you find out politically that the government works for companies and not for people, right?

Companies through lobbies pay the government.

The government collects money from people and distributes it to the other companies.

If that's the system, then they work for each other to keep each other in power 'cause they're still paying each other the same things, right?

So I think the DNC, you know, putting some senile guy up there, we were all like, "What?

He seems like..." I felt bad, like my own grandfather, I wouldn't keep him up.

Like, my grandfather's gotta lay down, he's gotta take a lay down.

Like, this is crazy.

I wouldn't have my grandfather going to Europe and then flying here.

- Yeah.

- It's like insane.

You know, my grandfather has a big book, he wants to take a lay down.

I go, "Take a lay down."

Like, do you know what I mean?

Like, they have him, you know, and then they put in Kamala last minute and she was establishment and then I was, you know, I remember... So it's like they knew that they were putting in someone that like, it was crazy to usher that in.

So I think both sides are... The side thing is falling apart.

It's being exposed, you know?

I'm on the side of the people.

I've never been red or blue.

I am for the people, by the people, of the people to the day I die.

So that's the only side I'm on, where are the people at?

- Are there any democratic politicians who you think are funny?

- Bernie, I think Bernie was funny.

And listen, now that my Netflix special has popped off, and by the grace of God and all of you again, I'm thinking maybe I give back.

Maybe I throw my name in.

You know?

You think Spencer Pratt's the only (beep) with a good idea?

Maybe I throw my name in the hat.

I wouldn't be surprised because it's like, if you like Trump or Bernie, you kind of end up at me.

(audience laughing) I was doing the math, I'm like, it could be me.

It might have to be.

So I don't know, I don't know.

I think they're both funny.

Maybe it's a New York thing.

- Isn't there another Robby Hoffman who's running for president, - There's a Robbie Hoffman and God bless him, we really put him on the map.

People were sending me pictures, Robbie Hoffman for president.

And it was even in my neighborhood, there was pictures on people's lawn, Robbie Hoffman for president.

And I was like, is this like Moses?

I've been like told that I have to run.

(audience laughing) Look, I literally thought up like, is this biblical?

And I'm like, "God, well, why me?

I'm in no position.

The pit bull people are after me.

I can't be out in public."

and no, truly it's this dude.

And God bless him, state of Florida.

He's got a little dog, like a terrier with him.

Think he's a gay thing from Florida.

I wish him well.

And he's been running for years.

He runs every four years.

I guess he's got parents' money.

I don't know what he has, but he gives a valiant effort.

And I think we got him some votes this year.

So I don't know.

(audience laughing) I don't know.

- I'm wondering if you think the concept of a joke has become diluted recently?

Like I feel like it's so common to go online and see something that's like hateful and then this part's like really important, like not even funny.

And then someone will just be like, "Oh, I was joking."

And I wonder if that's like offensive to you as someone who actually tells jokes.

- No, nothing's offensive to me, that's the problem.

- [Tyler] Absolutely not.

- And I also don't think being offended is that bad.

So let's say somebody is offended.

Okay, you were offended.

What are you expecting to live a life offended free?

I don't even understand the concept, you know what I mean?

It's like, I think we're gonna... I don't think being offended is that bad.

I think being poor is bad.

See, I go right back to here.

(audience laughing) - But I can't let you leave without asking you about "Unentitled," which is the series that you're developing for HBO.

I'm just wondering if you can tell us anything about it.

Give us like any updates on when it might come out.

- I can't.

- Okay.

(audience laughing) Nothing.

- Nothing.

- You're not gonna bring it back to the poor somehow?

- Oh, you watch, (audience laughing) you watch, you watch.

Yeah, no, I would say if I had to say anything, I'm not gonna say anything.

You almost got me.

You almost got me.

You almost got me.

But I think it's best to save it as surprise for you guys.

I think everybody will enjoy it.

- I think that's fair.

Yeah, well, thank you so much for being here, Robby.

- Thank you.

- Thank you guys for coming.

- Thank you, guys.

I appreciate you.

(lively music)